"Reading prove patience is a virtue"

[Ian Royal]

You don't get anything for being 9th. Same as we won't if we finish 12th. It's a mediocre position wouldn't you say?

No. You don't get anything for finishing 7th or 21st but they aren't mediocre positions. I consider how much of the season you are in reasonable contention to make the play offs / get relegated and how soon before the end of the season it's all over is the yardstick for medicority... typically finishing between 11th and 17th.

[Royal Lady]

So, "mid table mediocrity" then?

[prostak]

That depends on your expectations. And I'd suggest that someone whose expectations of this season were a genuine promotion push may well be a moron.

[Hoop Blah]

That depends on your expectations. And I'd suggest that someone whose expectations of this season were a genuine promotion push may well be a moron.

Expectations doesn't really change the outcome, which is looking like mid-table mediocrity. It might change how you view it.

We're about where I expected us to be, albeit we've looked a bit more likely to sneak 6th at times than I thought we might. It's a reasonable outcome (so far) but it's still a mediocre mid-table campaign.

[prostak]

This is turning into a discussion of semantics, but my point was and remains that you're unlikely to use 'mediocre' to describe a position you're satisfied with.

[PEARCEY]

That depends on your expectations. And I'd suggest that someone whose expectations of this season were a genuine promotion push may well be a moron.

Well I must be a moron to think we had a genuine chance this season having finished off last season so strongly. Of course I alongside many others had our expectations lowered by the somewhat premature sale of Siggy.

[Arch]

So, "mid table mediocrity" then?

Let's not beat about the bush. Twelfth at the end of the season would be mid-table mediocrity, not to mention a failure for the club. On the other hand, we've dropped to 12th on the back of a bad run of three games, before which we were not in a mediocre position.

Schards and others are being slightly revisionist. After his prediction of mid-table mediocrity, we got to the 46th game needing a win for automatic promotion. And last season was hardly the model of mid-table mediocrity either. So, yes, we could end up in mid-table mediocrity this season, but I wouldn't be claiming too much vindication for a prediction about the "foreseeable future" from two years ago.

[prostak]

So you did have lower expectations then. I did the same, to be honest - had we kept him he could've been our Charlie Adam figure, but I really don't want to open the 'what if' debate again.

As several have made the comparison across a few threads, I think it's worthwhile taking a look at Blackpool's team for the Playoff Final last year and judging whether there's a similar level of talent in our current XI.

Blackpool 2010 - Matt Gilks, Stephen Crainey, Ian Evatt, Alex John-Baptiste, Seamus Coleman, Keith Southern, David Vaughan (Barry Bannan, 90), Charlie Adam, Brett Ormerod (Stephen Dobbie, 60), Gary Taylor-Fletcher (Ben Burgess, 53), DJ Campbell

Reading 2011 (QPR game) - A. Federici, M. Mills, I. Harte, A. Griffin, I. Ingimarsson, J. McAnuff, J. Tabb (H. Robson-Kanu 76), J. Kebe, J. Karacan, S. Long, S. Church (M. Manset, 68).

I can't say I'm overly familiar with Blackpool's squad, so maybe others can help me out here. The key players for me would be Adam and Kebe respectively, and my first thought there is that Adam seems far more suited to the Premier than our Jimmy. As great as he is, Kebe is still the sort who can disappear from a game after a sufficiently menacing tackle (as happened against QPR), and I'm concerned he'd be useless in a league where his pace was less of a boon.

Neither team is exactly filled with superstars, but the tactics employed by Holloway and McDermott are an obvious difference. Maybe I've just seen a bad group of games, but from what I have seen the best-case scenario were we to gain promotion would be Allardyce Bolton, worst-case would be Megson Bolton.

[PEARCEY]

When you look at that Blackpool team you have to say Holloway has worked mircales to win promotion. Adam was massive for them last season and I like Vaughan..a good,tidy midfielder. Gilks is a decent keeper....and after that I'm struggling a bit.
Part of the problem we have this season is that it looks like it will take more points to finish 6th this season than it did last year...maybe as many as 75/76. That does us no favours at all.

[LoyalRoyalFan]

So you did have lower expectations then. I did the same, to be honest - had we kept him he could've been our Charlie Adam figure, but I really don't want to open the 'what if' debate again.

As several have made the comparison across a few threads, I think it's worthwhile taking a look at Blackpool's team for the Playoff Final last year and judging whether there's a similar level of talent in our current XI.

Blackpool 2010 - Matt Gilks, Stephen Crainey, Ian Evatt, Alex John-Baptiste, Seamus Coleman, Keith Southern, David Vaughan (Barry Bannan, 90), Charlie Adam, Brett Ormerod (Stephen Dobbie, 60), Gary Taylor-Fletcher (Ben Burgess, 53), DJ Campbell

Reading 2011 (QPR game) - A. Federici, M. Mills, I. Harte, A. Griffin, I. Ingimarsson, J. McAnuff, J. Tabb (H. Robson-Kanu 76), J. Kebe, J. Karacan, S. Long, S. Church (M. Manset, 68).

I can't say I'm overly familiar with Blackpool's squad, so maybe others can help me out here. The key players for me would be Adam and Kebe respectively, and my first thought there is that Adam seems far more suited to the Premier than our Jimmy. As great as he is, Kebe is still the sort who can disappear from a game after a sufficiently menacing tackle (as happened against QPR), and I'm concerned he'd be useless in a league where his pace was less of a boon.

Neither team is exactly filled with superstars, but the tactics employed by Holloway and McDermott are an obvious difference. Maybe I've just seen a bad group of games, but from what I have seen the best-case scenario were we to gain promotion would be Allardyce Bolton, worst-case would be Megson Bolton.

Difference there is that Blackpool were prepared to bring in players on loan.

[prostak]

And where has that got them now? Tumbling toward the relegation zone with a small squad now suffering a mild injury crisis, with players who don't all appear to be as 'happy just to be there' as first thought.

If Reading do go up again, I'm confident that our squad policy and thriving academy will mean we have the strength in depth to survive that sort of thing. This is why a mid-table finish this year won't feel like mediocrity or stagnation to me - I'm content to have faith that we're building and strengthening. I don't want players like Aiyegbeni "picture of dorian" Yakubu on loan, cos it seems like cheating and ultimately self-defeating. Much better to save on the repeated signing-on fees and bloated wages and grow your own, don't you think?

[Ian Royal]

So, "mid table mediocrity" then?

Quite simply, no. Stop trying to push your view on to what I say and actually read and consider what I post. Just because we happen to have dropped out of the top 10 briefly during a run of particularly tough games does not mean we will stay out of it. I still expect us to finish in the top 10.

[PEARCEY]

And where has that got them now? Tumbling toward the relegation zone with a small squad now suffering a mild injury crisis, with players who don't all appear to be as 'happy just to be there' as first thought.

If Reading do go up again, I'm confident that our squad policy and thriving academy will mean we have the strength in depth to survive that sort of thing. This is why a mid-table finish this year won't feel like mediocrity or stagnation to me - I'm content to have faith that we're building and strengthening. I don't want players like Aiyegbeni "picture of dorian" Yakubu on loan, cos it seems like cheating and ultimately self-defeating. Much better to save on the repeated signing-on fees and bloated wages and grow your own, don't you think?

Yes but only if those Academy players are good enough. How many of our current players that have gone through the Academy would be good enough in the Premiership?........

[Harpers So Solid Crew]

little early to be crowing... we've been competitive for the play offs for the equivalent of two of the last three seasons and a couple of wins and we're right back in the pack again this season.

But then if you want to be negative and see the worst in everything then that's easy enough. I don't consider 9th mediocrity by any stretch of the imagination. Each to their own.

Look back and we really were not play off material last season, and as for three years in one we got relegated!! what does equivalent mean? Tis season cannot count as one of the last 3 as still happening.

[PEARCEY]

We were play off contenders last season. We stuttered towards the end with draws against Cardiff,West Brom and Scunthorpe and defeat to Newcastle....but we were not a million miles behind Blackpool.

[Ian Royal]

little early to be crowing... we've been competitive for the play offs for the equivalent of two of the last three seasons and a couple of wins and we're right back in the pack again this season.

But then if you want to be negative and see the worst in everything then that's easy enough. I don't consider 9th mediocrity by any stretch of the imagination. Each to their own.

Look back and we really were not play off material last season, and as for three years in one we got relegated!! what does equivalent mean? Tis season cannot count as one of the last 3 as still happening.

Two of the last three seasons, current included.

Of course we weren't play off material last season... we still weren't far off making it in the end though, so very far from a season of mid-table mediocrity. It was a half a season of relegation near certainty followed by half a season of near automatics form.

To me mid-table mediocrity means spending most of your season sitting between 11th and 17th with little prospect of play offs or relegation. A season of utter tedium. That is not something that we do.

[Harpers So Solid Crew]

seriously we were not, as fans we looked and thought what if, but last 9 games were 3-3-3

and that was the games after Leicester away, when we were 11th. And a max of 78 if we won all the last 9, was never going to happen.

[PEARCEY]

We had to play catch-up in the second-half of last season but from January through to May we were a very good outfit. We just couldn't afford to drop many points because of the poor start to the season...but we were play-off contenders albeit as long-shots.
Looking at the current table it will take 5/6 points more to make 6th place this season compared to last year.

[PEARCEY]

seriously we were not, as fans we looked and thought what if, but last 9 games were 3-3-3

and that was the games after Leicester away, when we were 11th. And a max of 78 if we won all the last 9, was never going to happen.

WRONG WRONG WRONG. When we played West Brom towards the end of March we were only three points behind Blackpool with two games in hand. Admittedly by the time we played Newcastle towards mid-April we were seven points behind them with two games in hand....but it shows that we had closed right up on the team that finished 6th towards the back end of the season...
I've just checked my match-day programmes for the stats above. They had 54 points to our 51 as we went into the West Brom game.
We were play-off contenders partly because the teams directly above us were really struggling. Blackpool did get their act together and gathered a fair few points from their final 5/6 games but were still reliant on Swansea not winning at home on the final day of the season to ensure they made the play-offs.
Its also worth noting that at the time of the West Brom game Blackpool had only 54 points from 39 games. Leeds currently in 6th have 52 points from 31 games...its going to take around 76 points to finish 6th this season if the trend continues.

[Royal Lady]

You don't get anything for being 9th. Same as we won't if we finish 12th. It's a mediocre position wouldn't you say?

No. You don't get anything for finishing 7th or 21st but they aren't mediocre positions. I consider how much of the season you are in reasonable contention to make the play offs / get relegated and how soon before the end of the season it's all over is the yardstick for medicority... typically finishing between 11th and 17th.

So, "mid table mediocrity" then?

Quite simply, no. Stop trying to push your view on to what I say and actually read and consider what I post. Just because we happen to have dropped out of the top 10 briefly during a run of particularly tough games does not mean we will stay out of it. I still expect us to finish in the top 10.

LOL

You said yourself that the yardstick for mediocrity was typically finishing between 11th and 17th - so I referred to it as "mid table mediocrity".