Hard to see any progress for the forseeable future

[RG30]

It's always interesting / revealing to read the comments of other teams' supporters and, from what I've seen, Swansea, Doncaster, Wolves, Burnley (twice), Bristol City and Sheff Wed all think we are the best team in the division.

Forest, Charlton and QPR for starters have good ground to think otherwise but I think most observers (particularly the fans of the 6 clubs aforementioned) would be very surprised to think that some of our own supporters still view play-offs as the most realistic aim.

It's a pretty meaningless statement without consistency but most would agree that we have shown ourselves to be the best team in the division on our day and, having already had several of those days this season, I think there are excellent grounds for continued optimism.

I think your last paragraph sums it up fairly well, Reading on their best day in this league can hammer anyone. When Reading play well then other teams in this division will struggle to live with them, and when you think about it that should exactly be the case. The problem for Reading thus far is maintaining a consistency in particular away from home. They have been genuinely unlcuky at 1 or 2 places but that's coupled with some bad defeats and performances in others. They aren't anywhere near the side they were last time in this division but in all honesty they aren't likely to be, no one will be that good again so to judge them against that is slightly harsh. Reading aren't anywhere near the finished article and you look through the side/squad and think we could probably do better there or get another player in this position but with this squad they will almost certainly contest in the top 6. The problem will be the January transfer window, I just can't see Doyle or S Hunt being here after it, how they go about replacing these two willd efine how Reading's season goes. The answer isn't in the squad currently so they will have to spend a bit of dosh to replace these two key players.

I think both comments by yourself and Rother sum up how I feel at the moment. We still got 1 or 2 injured players to come back (Doobs, Murts). I would still hold a question mark over our depth of strikers. Does Shane Long have the ability to step in and score goals when it's needed. Are we better off keeping Lita at Norwich where he is playing regularly, scoring or here at Reading being ineffective but any sniff of a goal and you want him to be finishing it off.

I think Birmingham will definetely nab 1 of the 2 top spots, consistenly they are getting results the most and seem to have a determination and togetherness about them. Wolves have to be the target for us, they're just behind us in terms of best footballing sides in the Championship but you always feel with the inexperience they possess, they're liable to hit a bad run.

[Old Biscuitman]

Now to the end of the year is critical for Reading, personally we have to look to get ourselves established in the top 2 to maximise keeping Doyle etc. in January.

If we don't manage that we we could be looking at a very different team in February together with all the problems that would bring.

Absolutely agree. Being in an automatic promotion spot at year end is as much about keeping our best players as it is about being promoted, albeit there is a correlation between the two events.

[Royal Rother]

Interesting that we'd be 6 points clear at the top if points were awarded for the score at half-time, but would only be 4 points off the top if points were just awarded for 2nd half "results".

All those missing points....!

[Sun Tzu]

I suspect keeping Doyle and Hunt is going to be as much about how we are playing as where we are in the league. I have no real basis for the hunch but I feel that if we are scoring goals, playing good football and the players are enjoying themselves there is more chance of them staying than if we are scraping 1-0 wins with late winners.

I don't actually think January will be that big a deal, both Doyle and Hunt may well look at things and decide the summer is a better time to consider their futures. Buyers in January are more likely to be 'desperate' whereas summer buyers are more genuinely building sides, plus by January the number of clubs in Europe is smaller.

[Woodcote Royal]

Totally agree with your last paragraph provided we're still in the mix for promotion through January but can't help worrying about 'arry being desperate for a striker

[Sun Tzu]

He'll be back to Pompey for Defoe though won't he ? Going for Doyle would be quite a gamble and he didn't some for him when he was at Pompey - he saw Nugent as a better option !

[Victor Meldrew]

It's always interesting / revealing to read the comments of other teams' supporters and, from what I've seen, Swansea, Doncaster, Wolves, Burnley (twice), Bristol City and Sheff Wed all think we are the best team in the division.

Forest, Charlton and QPR for starters have good ground to think otherwise but I think most observers (particularly the fans of the 6 clubs aforementioned) would be very surprised to think that some of our own supporters still view play-offs as the most realistic aim.

It's a pretty meaningless statement without consistency but most would agree that we have shown ourselves to be the best team in the division on our day and, having already had several of those days this season, I think there are excellent grounds for continued optimism.

We're a very good side if we get our noses in front. I think the doubts surround the fact that as yet we don't really convince that we can win enough of the tight games when the going gets tough. If i recall the Palace game is the only one in absolute ages that we went behind in and came back to win.

Theres just a certain fragility about us that makes me think play-offs are the more realistic hope. That said, I think we've adapted far quicker this season than i thought we would.

That pretty well sums up how I feel about how we stand.
I really do feel that now Doyle and Bikey and to a lesser extent Harper and Hunt are so important to our side and make us better than the Burnleys,QPRs and the Swanseas but on a par with Birmingham,Wolves and Sheff Utd.
I feel that these clubs are less vulnerable to being raided in January than we are based on what has been said by the club earlier this season and you do often find that teams which rely on a high energy method of play tend to fade towards the end of a long season.
If we retain the key players in January that would be a statement of intent but the words from the club and the willingness to sell (remember how close Doyle was to leaving for Spurs on deadline day) still make me feel very apprehensive about the foreseeable future or at least until January has been and gone.

[Sun Tzu]

If we retain the key players in January that would be a statement of intent but the words from the club and the willingness to sell (remember how close Doyle was to leaving for Spurs on deadline day) still make me feel very apprehensive about the foreseeable future or at least until January has been and gone.

I think we were not ever at all close to selling Doyle were we ?

Spurs claim they tried to make a last minute call but we didn't respond, suggesting we weren't interested in selling.

I also don;t think we should take any comments made in the summer (by anyone) and assume they hold good in January. Allowing people to leave when you are building a new team is one thing but once you have thatteam performing and doing well you may well take a harder line.

[Victor Meldrew]

If we retain the key players in January that would be a statement of intent but the words from the club and the willingness to sell (remember how close Doyle was to leaving for Spurs on deadline day) still make me feel very apprehensive about the foreseeable future or at least until January has been and gone.

I think we were not ever at all close to selling Doyle were we ?

Spurs claim they tried to make a last minute call but we didn't respond, suggesting we weren't interested in selling.

I also don;t think we should take any comments made in the summer (by anyone) and assume they hold good in January. Allowing people to leave when you are building a new team is one thing but once you have thatteam performing and doing well you may well take a harder line.

The concensus is that we were about 5 minutes away from losing Doyle-it all came down to whether Man Utd would let Campbell go to Spurs on loan as part of the Berbatov deal and fortunately for us they did.
I hope you are right about a change of mind come January but I do fear that we have become a selling club just as we were in 1995.

[brendywendy]

i thought the consensus was that spurs called us after 10 oclock on the day, when hammond had already said we were closed for business from about 9 due to the fact that we wouldnt be able to replace in that time

they rang an empty office because everyone had gone home

how that can be construed as minutes away from losing doyle i dont know

[Dirk Gently]

..... I hope you are right about a change of mind come January but I do fear that we have become a selling club just as we were in 1995.

We have always been a selling club and the odds are we always will be - that's the reality of football finance. Even Spurs are a selling club. There are only 4 clubs in England who aren't selling clubs - and even Man Utd couldn't have really not sold Ronaldo if Real Madrid had really been determined.

[RG30]

..... I hope you are right about a change of mind come January but I do fear that we have become a selling club just as we were in 1995.

We have always been a selling club and the odds are we always will be - that's the reality of football finance. Even Spurs are a selling club. There are only 4 clubs in England who aren't selling clubs - and even Man Utd couldn't have really not sold Ronaldo if Real Madrid had really been determined.

Make that 3, Arsene Wenger admitted even Arsenal were a selling club only a couple of months ago

[brendywendy]

there were periods in our history that we werent a selling club
but these were usually when we had no players anyone else wanted

[Royal With Cheese]

there were periods in our history that we werent a selling club
but these were usually when we had no players anyone else wanted

Damn! I was about to post that.

FTR I think Doyler will stay - judging by his comments I read in a red top today (can't remember which). Not sure about Hunty though. It will be very interesting come January if we are in the top two. Let's hope we have that problem!

Wow - this season really has been dull. Oh, and uninspiring.

[Arch]

..... I hope you are right about a change of mind come January but I do fear that we have become a selling club just as we were in 1995.

We have always been a selling club and the odds are we always will be - that's the reality of football finance. Even Spurs are a selling club. There are only 4 clubs in England who aren't selling clubs - and even Man Utd couldn't have really not sold Ronaldo if Real Madrid had really been determined.

We didn't sell anyone we wanted to keep for about a decade before this summer. A selling club would have sold Sidwell.

[Sun Tzu]

Not sure what definition of being a selling club people are working to.

For me a selling club is one who works by flogging off players as a deliberate policy - and sees a good player in terms of what sort of transfer fee they will generate rather than what they can do on the pitch. On this basis we've not been a selling club and the couple of spells where we have seen top players go have been more as a result of them wanting to leave than us looking to cash in. If we were a selling club as I have defined it we'd have sold players like Cureton, Forster, Caskey etc etc at their peak rather than as they were in decline.

If you define a 'selling' club as one who would sell a player if a big offer was made then that includes just about every team in the league and is probably not very meaningful. Clubs like Crewe are selling clubs because they want to be, we've not been of that ilk for a long time (if ever)

[papereyes]

Not sure what definition of being a selling club people are working to.

For me a selling club is one who works by flogging off players as a deliberate policy - and sees a good player in terms of what sort of transfer fee they will generate rather than what they can do on the pitch. On this basis we've not been a selling club and the couple of spells where we have seen top players go have been more as a result of them wanting to leave than us looking to cash in. If we were a selling club as I have defined it we'd have sold players like Cureton, Forster, Caskey etc etc at their peak rather than as they were in decline.

If you define a 'selling' club as one who would sell a player if a big offer was made then that includes just about every team in the league and is probably not very meaningful. Clubs like Crewe are selling clubs because they want to be, we've not been of that ilk for a long time (if ever)

Other than a handful of summers - 95, 07 and 08 mainly - I don't think we've really been in the position where teams were making that many bids for our players.

[Sun Tzu]

Other than a handful of summers - 95, 07 and 08 mainly - I don't think we've really been in the position where teams were making that many bids for our players.

Despite us having some fairly successful, high profile players. The arguement that we've not had any good players falls down, which perhaps suggests that bids were discouraged at the early 'informal enquiry' stage, or that we let it be known that we were not a selling club....

[papereyes]

Other than a handful of summers - 95, 07 and 08 mainly - I don't think we've really been in the position where teams were making that many bids for our players.

Despite us having some fairly successful, high profile players. .

Not high profile in the grand scheme of things, though, I think.

I think being a club on the up, as we have been (for the most part) since 1993, means players would tend to stick with a safer bet than a gamble. When a player has wanted to move on, he's usually gone. Although not always to better things.

I'm not saying we are or are not a selling club, btw, I just don't think we've ever recently been in a position where it has mattered.

[Sun Tzu]

Fair comment, although the vast majority of clubs probably don;t have players who are high profile either. They would stillprobably be considered 'selling' clubs by many.

Probably just re emphasises the fact that you can swing this either way depending on how you define the term...